I've been reading conflicting information about progestin induced gyno. Some say there must be estrogen present for gyno to develop. Whats the real story? So If I am taking low dose letro would gyno be a concern while on tren/deca being letro will lower estrogen? Would lactation be the only issue?
Tren turned me into an anti-social psychotic. Horrible drug imho.Originally Posted by alkaline
Yes you can get gyno from either of them and lactate and have absolutely no chance of having an erection in quite a while.
Both of those effect my erection function HUGELY. Dostonex/cabergoline will combat this but it is expensive.
Im not a fan of either of those either.
I found that I had to run at least 750mg of test to maintain any kind of sex drive. So you have a drug like TREN that is affecting prolactin and has progesterone effects and you end up in this delicate dance trying to keep the estrogen levels right so you can still have an erection/orgasm. I believe Caber is a MUST HAVE. In my case the anti-social tendencies is what drove me away combined with horrendous acne. Winstrol or D-bol are a good synergistic stack with TREN A, but jeez combined with the AIs you have a recipe for joint disaster. TREN (I believe) is very difficult to manage in a normal lifestyle setting. If all you do is go to the gym and have no wife, GF, or friends.. then go for it. When you're alone... the sweaty sheets matter little.
I have a very close bodybuilder friend who could only run tren for a few weeks, it made his gyno flare up, he had to change his sheets every night and was waking up dehydrated, screamed at his fiancee (she's a saint and understood it was the tren talking), and his libido became nonexistent.
This was with oral D-Bol and 600mg Test.
Tren= body looks great.. but at what cost..??? plus my joints felt like crap AND surprisingly terrible lethargy (T3 suppression?)
I took Exemestane 25mg daily and no gyno issues whatsoever..
I've played with it and the only side I got was night sweats. I liked the results and will try it again. But my origional question, Can Deca/tren cause gyno in the abscence (or low levels) of estrogen, is still un answered.
Everything I've read states that in the absence of estrogen, gyno is a non-issue with Tren. Letrozole to be safe.. but you will squash your estrogen levels. Which brings up the whole topic of low estrogen inhibiting gains (look at the Tren A/ estrogen mix for cattle).
Pre-existing dormant or unnoticed gynecomastia can possibly be "awakened" by tren without excess estrogen.
Thanks.
So based on you statement and the word "possibly" makes me think it is not of too much of a concern for most. I've never had a problem with gyno (that I know of, no lumps or sensitivity) then my assumption would be that my chances are low. I will still take the proper supps to combat prolactin (just in case).
On a side note. For you guys with gyno. What exactily does it feel like? Is it a hard ball under the nipple or does it feel like a fatty deposite?
Gyno can be undetected and minor, but acute gynecomastia is usually-tender, palpable lumps. (Almost all gynecomastia eventually becomes hardened and fibrous after which point surgery may be required to remove.) Sometimes the tenderness is a precursor with no lumps detectable. You want to grab around the nipple from the sides of the areola, pinch with moderate force (not enough to hurt a "normal" nipple) and rub the whole thing between your fingers. A hard lump that is not the nipple itself is probably gynecomastia. A small amount of gyno you have not previously noticed is nothing to worry about UNLESS you take androgenic or "progestin-like" steroids, and notice it getting worse.
In other words it's nice to know if the problem was pre-existing. As far as I know you cannot create new gynecomastia with "progestin-like" steroids, but you of course could develop a nasty case with androgenic steroids and progestin-like steroids.
I think most people go overboard with their cabergoline before exhausting the possibility that it's caused by estrogen. I'd probably take first a low dose of AI, then a moderate dose of AI, before adding in a very low dose of cabergoline. The cabergoline can have extremely deleterious effects on mental health in steroid users, and may be partly to blame for a lot of crazy steroid user behavior that is wrongly attributed to (just) steroids.
Rubbing my nipples in my office. My employees are looking at me funny! Told one of my guys here that I'm trying to induce lactation to save money on coffee creamer. HAHA
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